Difficulty of Mesecraft

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  • #813
    odie
    Participant
    • Posts: 30
    Rank: Newbie

    From my own experience, I know that Mesecraft can be extremely challenging, especially for inexperienced players. It’s possible that such players still have basic game mechanics they need to familiarize themselves with. For example, I first thought (still on a “Saras Simple Survival Server”) it would be a good idea to move my mining activities to the night when it is dark outside anyway. (Big mistake when you only have a wooden armor and a stone sword.) This led to me never getting the materials for a metal armor until the server was relaunched at some point. (By the way: Iron ore was already within my reach at some point. I just never managed to get enough of it to the surface. Somehow I never made it to the surface alive).

    I think that inexperienced players will like to try to get along with the surface environment first before they go into the dangers of the depths. I should add that the knowledge of how to build efficient and safe mines may not be there. (As are many other tricks that more experienced players take for granted. And as it was for me then, and possibly still is to some extent now).

    Also, Minetest newbies usually don’t take it that easy to get killed. Minetest is a little different than many other games with a first-person perspective in this regard. Getting killed is usually not that tragic for progress in the game. However, this may have to be learned first.

    By the way, I think this is one of the reasons why many new players leave the Mesecraft Survival Server #1 soon. It is very frustrating to be killed 3 times or more in the first 5 minutes. I think new players then often don’t feel up to the challenge. However, I am currently planning to make New Ho (Ale Post) safer after completing 1 ½ more buildings.

    Just to eliminate any misunderstanding about the difficulty level from the start: I don’t think Mesecraft should get easier. I just think that it would be good to somehow create the possibility for more inexperienced, impulsive and / or not so patient players to find their way into the challenging level of the game. Of course, you could put books in the game that tell beginners about useful hints, but the reward center in a player’s brain responds much better when they are largely or entirely responsible for their own successes.

    Another thought that just comes to mind:

    Maybe it would be good to put a wooden armor or a reinforced cactus armor or something similar directly into the inventory of new players. This would send the signal that self-protection is important in Mesecraft. Experienced players won’t need them soon anyway.And inexperienced players will have something worth recovering after they died the first time. This alone may keep them busy for a while… If they make it at all.

    #814
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    I think you are very right, as when I first joined Mesecraft(Back when it was still called Sara’s Simple Survival Server) in 2019, I died more than 14 times in the first 10 minutes of playing.  And for ores, well back then there was no market and Df caverns had also not been added yet, back then there was a different cave mod. The only way to get ores safely for me was to go to the moon using the Meseportal( Which got removed and replaced with moon portals). then about a two months later, the server restarted and instead died 5 times in the first 10 minutes but still trusted the Moon to give me ores, that server lasted a long time, not sure how long as I left in the the summer of 2020 because of family issues, but the day before Thanksgiving 2021, I returned and it was a new server with a new name, this time I died 2 times in the first 10 minutes, using the knowledge I had gained a year and a half ago, was able to get ores on my own (Meaning stealing from MisterE’s mine) and was able to only die 29 times in the entire time I was on that server, and when the server got restarted in January 2022 I suddenly relized how well I had become and how long it had taken me to reach that goal, as I didn’t die at all in the first ten minutes and in my total time of about 30 hours of playing this new server I have only died 3 times, doing stupid stuff. However, I got all my wealth in the game completely on my own with out using anybodys mine (Besides 3 gold ingots, but that was an invite to use the mine) So yes, I think Difficulty is a major thing on Mesecraft and I have seen  dozens of new players leave because they died to much. And I can agree that Mesecraft has gotten harder over the years as well. And yes I really think books might help, as when I joined I had know Idea what to do, lol.

    #827
    komodo
    Participant
    • Posts: 81
    Rank: Newbie

    I’m king of glad to hear there was a bit of a learning curve, it’s what makes us feel we’ve made progress or gotten better.

    I’m always interested in improving player balance and retaining new players. So I .hope we can take these suggestions seriously. I don’t want to make the game harder either. But I’d also like to add some new things like forging metal with molten and molds and being able to sell them.

    So how do you make it so it’s not too easy for veteran players to get bored, but doesn’t make newbie players run immediately. Maybe armor like Odie suggested, but also, maybe a tutorial. Not really sure. 🙂

    #829
    komodo
    Participant
    • Posts: 81
    Rank: Newbie

    What if there was a separate vertical biome (like way up) that was a separate kind of tutorial intro biome with easier enemies and a more playful world? Then you sort need to get items and solve puzzles and graduate/are sent into the actual world we use now.

    • This reply was modified 10 months ago by komodo.
    • This reply was modified 10 months ago by komodo.
    • This reply was modified 10 months ago by komodo.
    #833
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    Noob Deminsion, lol.

    #834
    komodo
    Participant
    • Posts: 81
    Rank: Newbie

    lol, didnt think of that but yeah lol. I dont want to be banished to the noob dimension. But it’s true, maybe a biome could be setup that contains new players and once you graduate from it (by doing a quest or something) you can’t go back without turning into a zombie or something. I’m thinking like a forbidden magical forest or something with easier enemies and can setup the world before it is corrupted by war or greed or something. Then when the player leaves that dimension they can join in the adventure of cleansing the world of corruption in different biomes.

    #835
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    So, it’s like the last surviving non-corrupted piece of land, and was enchanted to keep people who have been infected with the corruption out of it.

    #860
    komodo
    Participant
    • Posts: 81
    Rank: Newbie

    I’ve been thinking maybe a way to add boss battles or something in each biome. And when a boss is killed in that biome it cleanses the biome somehow and the corruption starts to fade away and restore the biome.

    Also, it would push character progression as you would get items or rewards and grow somehow each time you restore a biome. As you progress, your character sort of grows up or takes on the corruption in a way, becoming more of an adult in a way. more experienced but also jaded somehow in their appearance or character. Not in a bad way, but just as a fact of dealing with hard things or in dealing with evil. it grows on you in a way because you have to take it on and sort of sacrafice a part of yourself to bring order back to the world.

    #1349
    carzomg
    Participant
    • Posts: 95
    Rank: Newbie

    Recently, Keihdra gave me a build tour which was rather impressive. It made me think of a way to show appreciation for master players, eg. The Mineman Award. I know advanced players may gain additional responsibility as assistant admins but maybe a Hall of Fame or something that provides recognition. Kiopy7, AlexGIF, and others, I would consider master builders and I could be wrong but Mineman would be the standard barer on this server.

    #1350
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    Calling people “Master Players” Is kinda a stretch, as we have many people with unique abilities, and holding one over the other can make people a little jealous. Also there has never been an assistant admin ever in the server’s history, and there most likely never will be as we really don’t need one. Also naming a reward for being a “master” builder the “Mineman Reward” is kinda wrong. While Mineman is an exceptional builder and I have seen many of his builds, on Mesecraft and other servers, there are many people who have remarkable building skills as well such as Amicus, MisterE, Sundance, Giorge, Brown Bear, Keihdra, and many other people. I just think that singling one person out as the best builder on Mesecraft and naming a reward after them without their consent just isn’t what should be in Mesecraft.

    *Edit* There are also many people who don’t show their skill in building all the time, like myself and many others, mostly because of this reason, they don’t want people gushing over their work like it’s the best thing ever built.

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by Kiopy7.
    #1352
    carzomg
    Participant
    • Posts: 95
    Rank: Newbie

    That is the purpose of this forum topic, suggestion and discussion. Brainstorming ideas and listening to the pros and cons. The thread was addressing helping newbies and challenging veterans by supplying encouragement and support. Ho and similar builds make the server attractive and an inspiration to new players with a variety of skills. How we supply incentive is the focus, as komodo posted earlier, ” I’m kind of glad to hear there was a bit of a learning curve, it’s what makes us feel we’ve made progress or gotten better.”

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by carzomg.
    #1354
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    I totally get that! I just think it’s a bad incentive.

    #1355
    carzomg
    Participant
    • Posts: 95
    Rank: Newbie

    So noted, appreciate the feedback.

    #1356
    keihdra
    Participant
    • Posts: 63
    Rank: Newbie

    Glad you enjoyed Himinnfjell, carzomg. Mineman welcomed me when I first started playing and helped with my first build, the Hobbit Hole, so he would be a good one to name an award after. But like Kip said, there are so many ways to measure a master builder and I’m not sure that singling anyone out is the best way to do that. That said, I’d rather honor players that help others out. Guys like mineman, kiopy7, Odie, and giorge helped me when I got started here and so now I’ve tried helping other players too. That’s the stuff that builds community.

    #1357
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    Yep! Absolutely! Another thing to keep in mind is that Mesecraft’s main goal is to give players a unique survival experience, not for people to build cool stuff.

    #1358
    komodo
    Participant
    • Posts: 81
    Rank: Newbie

    Just my 2 cents, it would be nice to consider excellent builds maybe as schematics into the game that can spawn like villages with features or special things in them. There is a schematics editor mod that I wanted to try out. Maybe it would help include more places into the game.  I agree with Kiopy7 that we shouldn’t but experienced and talented builders on a pedestal, but it would be nice to have awards or honors or just a showcase for some of the places people have built.

    #1359
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    I think if any new structures were to be added into the game, they should blend in with the surroundings, like they are supposed to be there and have been there for some time. This means that they can’t be too exceptional, but they can still be pretty great builds. Also I do think the idea of an award system could have potential. For example, a building can be built in the main spawn area acting as the showcase, there can be awards such as: Most amount of days survived, Biggest building, most creative building, most impressive farm, most wealthy, and so on.

    #1362
    carzomg
    Participant
    • Posts: 95
    Rank: Newbie

    Good discussion.

    #1783
    senordmt
    Participant
    • Posts: 10
    Rank: Newbie

    i’m still a pretty inexperienced player, though i’ve played some really HARD MT subgames, such as Exile (brutal, as the description says), and Enyekala, where even falling 2 nodes u take damage, and restoring health is very hard; so maybe it’s just all relative, but i find Mesecraft to be WAY too easy. all you have to do as a beginner is walk and soon you’ll find a village or a shipwreck and you’ll have so much loot, and accommodations without any effort at all, besides simply walking there. yes there are mobs but i haven’t encountered anything so hard that i died before getting loaded up with free armors, food, and weapons, and all sorts of gadgets and building materials.

    • This reply was modified 4 weeks ago by senordmt.
    #1787
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    I agree with this 100% as I never had in trouble getting started or learning how to play mesecraft when I first joined 4 years ago, I was extremely new to minetest itself as well. However the difficulty most of the people on this thread are talking is about the servers as, since it’s a server, mob spawns are increased, loot and help chests disappear within hours, and the forests are usually completely chopped down. However, outside of the servers, I do agree it’s a little too easy.

    #1788
    Kiopy7
    Participant
    • Posts: 138
    Rank: Newbie

    I think a guide book should be the main focus to make it easier for new players.

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